European Union Forums

[Terry]

[willyoumind]

I loved the UK national anthem and I have repeatedily hearing it for over 10 times...lol

[Benn]

what is it that you like in it? It doesn't sound musically at all. ((

[Big_Becka]

This version has no words!!! Try this one:

We have a great national anthem. We particularly like the verse about crushing the rebellious Scots And we love making the Scots sing the verse about crushing the rebellious Scots Sadly, that verse doesn't normally get sung...

Of course, the Sex Pistols did a far better version of the National Anthem. Although I can probably still be hung for telling you that

[M.Helen]

Becka, don't risk your life in this case

I like the words

God Save the Queen

God save our gracious Queen,
Long live our noble Queen,
God save the Queen:
Send her victorious,
Happy and glorious,
Long to reign over us:
God save the Queen.

O Lord, our God, arise,
Scatter her enemies,
And make them fall.
Confound their politics,
Frustrate their knavish tricks,
On Thee our hopes we fix,
God save us all.

Thy choicest gifts in store,
On her be pleased to pour;
Long may she reign:
May she defend our laws,
And ever give us cause
To sing with heart and voice
God save the Queen.*

[Big_Becka]

Thanks, M. Helen There are actually more verses (and several different versions, including a French one for the Canadians!), but they are not usually sung. There is quite a bit on Wikipedia...

The anti-Scottish fourth verse (dating back to the Jacobite rebellion):

God grant that Marshall Wade
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
And like a torrent rush
Rebellious Scots to crush.
God save the King.

[Faw_Peter]

"Rebellious Scots to crush"?
I don't think it's nice to tell such things about Scots, we live in the 21st century. The anthem should be changed a little bit.

[Big_Becka]

In true British style, we just pretend it never existed Anyway, the Scots have their own national anthem, they don't tend to like ours

[Yalta1945]

Of course, the Sex Pistols did a far better version of the National Anthem.

As you mentioned Sex Pistols next to one of the symbols of national identity, do you think the punk culture is also part of British identity? When I saw presentation of London as the host of the next Olympic Games, I got an impression that they wanted to show punks as one of the elements of London's cultural diversity, that is, as an attractive and positive feature. Is now punk subculture thought to be incorporated into the image of the contemporary British culture? Is it, actually, British or English? Should we think about punk subculture as a of some treasure?

[Big_Becka]

Personally, yes, punk is very much part of Britain for me. The Britain I know looks nice for the tourists and the rich people, but is extremely angry if you look a little closer! We are as mad as a box of frogs! I feel a bit sad that we are losing some of that anger, and so many young people don't seem to care about the big issues any more (why should they? They have a warm house and a big TV, and have been taught at school that we are the best people in the world beside the Americans... )

I've noticed punk being used to promote London too! There are lots of adverts on the TV showing punks (including a butter advert featuring Johnny Rotton!), you can even buy postcards of punks in London! This is a bit weird, since the original punks were anarchists and were against this sort of thing...

It's pretty unusual that London wants to be associated with punk (and it does seem to be associated with London only nowadays ) What I'm trying to say is that history has been rewritten, so the punks are now just a fashion and music statment. Hence it is "safe" to be associated with them.

Punk happened everywhere in the UK, and is probably a national treasure in so far as it inspired a lot of our later music and fashion. For example, without punk there would have been no Manic Street Preachers. Subcultures have made it trendy for a young person to read books and question their place in society. This wasn't unique to punk (there were beatniks and hippies before), but punk reflected a sense of dissatisfaction that people felt during the 70s and 80s.

OK, there were also quite a few punks who just got pissed and had fights....

I think London has been rebranded as somewhere very trendy and diverse. People also make a big deal about the 60s fashions that came out of London (Biba, Carnaby Street...). Which is also weird, bacause most of the fringe culture in London nowadays is very Victorian gothic

[Yalta1945]

A few days ago the French got offended because Tunisians whistled on the French national anthem before a football match. Sarkozy said anti-French jeering.
Latvians disgusted a joke on their national anthem made by Russians during the popular song festival in Jūrmala (Russian event in Latvia) this summer.
These two cases are meant for comparison with Sex Pistols.

I am surprised by some trends from Britain. I used to believe “paparazzi” was an Italian word but I am not sure any more. Then these tourists in Riga… Do you know that the rating of Britons in Latvia lost even bigger part of its value than the British Pound? Britons are regarded as the worst among all Europeans by the public opinion in Latvia. Several similar incidents in Riga were most decisive… Of course, the local public may equally have not understood if anybody had made another version of their national anthem.

I’m from the generation who witnessed popularity of punks. I had a few punks among my classmates. I also attempted to modify my haircut as to give my tribute to punk culture, although it was almost impossible during Soviet times with strict control in schools. So I had to do it gradually One day they started noticing that my appearance had changed. Then I had to stop it. Everybody knew “Should I Stay Or Should I Go”. We were not allowed to neither sing patriotic songs, nor punk songs. So we did it during basketball or football matches and after them in the anonymous crowd. The football crowd was bigger. From even earlier years (of my childhood) I remember some spontaneous demonstrations after matches, the militsiya (the police) being rolled over in their cars... The stadium sector I used to attend regularly was known as the warmest and dearest. Someone from our sector would usually get arrested – for chanting, dressing, and disobeying, blasting pyrotechnics that used to be smuggled into the stadium. I could recall one particular event of total disobedience of hundreds of boys and girls (who also stand by us) when even the army personnel present at the stadium felt helpless (or rather bewildered) but it doesn’t matter now…
You may not believe but one of my classmates who used to have some punk flavour holds a very high position in the political system of his country. (I won’t be more precise because I don’t want to be identified by certain people on this forum.)

But I left it all behind, in my past. When I was a teen, I used to act as a teen.

We are as mad as a box of frogs!

I'll keep it away from my daughter - she likes frogs! €

It's pretty unusual that London wants to be associated with punk (and it does seem to be associated with London only nowadays ) What I'm trying to say is that history has been rewritten, so the punks are now just a fashion and music statment. Hence it is "safe" to be associated with them.

I noticed it 15 years ago in Denmark when looking at some Norwegian couple. Punks got combed and they turned into nice people long ago.

[Big_Becka]

I'm still struggling tot get to grips with this last post - did you really have your haircut controlled?! I think it does matter that people used to be rebellious and idealistic: these kind of acts remind the authorities who they serve! I remember seeing protests in Eastern Europe on TV, before the Iron Curtain collapsed - I was only young, but it was awesome. Our school atlases used to have Eastern Europe greyed out, and we only really learned about western Europe in geography lessons. I don't know if that was the same in everybody's schools.

I think there is a difference between being anti-monarchy and non-patriotic. For example, the Union Jack is used heavily in alternative fashions, even by people who do not support the Queen. Many people would argue that it would be best for the country to depose the Royal family and become a Republic. I think being a traitor is still illegal, but I will not face any consequences for saying this.

You also need to remember that the United Kingdom is not very united! Scotland and Wales are officially devolved, and you surely know about Northern Ireland. Other areas, like Cornwall, like to think of themselves as independent (Cornwall is a western county populated by Celtic people, who used to speak a language similar to Welsh and Breton).